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And wasn't much of it down to Super Aguri too?

Honestly, I don't.

I like Jenson very much, he's a very nice guy and had a great career. I don't wanna see it ending with a massacre a la Kimi had this year. Plus, Mclaren is likekly to remain about the same(or worse, depending on how Honda PU will perform) in pecking order, so it would be just another year of collecting 6-10th positions.

it was so good to be true a car designed by Honda winning the championship

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Motorsports trend for 2024: everything is a bad taste joke now

Which was a very weakpoint anyway. Without the Mercedes engine I doubt Honda/Brawn would have won in 2009.



The double diffuser was a concept identified and created by a Super Aguri designer. The chassis was then designed around that concept by Ross Brawn's squad.

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Dunno, the Brawn car was really good especially in the beginning. If Honda stayed on they could have pomped a shitload of money in the car so it would have been good troughout the whole season. The weak point of Brawn was their lack of money thus not being able to develop the car that well, this gave Red Bull a chance to catch up with them throughout the season.

Honda had the weakest engine in the 2-3 years ahead of their departure, not by much but it wasn't on par with the Renault and Mercedes of the period. Brawn would have / could have won races with the Honda engine but it would never have challenged for the titles.

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I don't buy that at all. There was very little in it between the engines at that point in time - the difference was all in the aero. The Brawn would still have been by far the fastest car for half a season and quick enough to get Button the title in the second half. The only difference would've been Bruno Senna in the second seat instead of Rubens

In any case, McLaren should go with Magnussen. Button was in a similar position after his first year - he did as well as Magnussen has this year, perhaps slightly tidier. But Frank decided to loan him out, and 2001 nearly ruined his career. If Magnussen was to be loaned out to another midfield team (although there aren't any left atm) or left on the sidelines for a year, it would probably do similar damage to his reputation. I'd rather not see Button out of F1 but if it's between the two, Magnussen's got more to offer long-term - we've had enough of short-termist decisions that have ruined drivers' careers in the last few years, we don't need another one

I don't buy that at all. The Honda engine was a bag of nails and was known to be down on power and drive-ability versus the top powerplants.

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Which explains why Honda's best dry result of 2007 was at Monza, of course

The car had zero downforce or mechanical grip which explains why the car had next to no decent performance anywhere else. That helped at Monza.

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I thought it was meant to be a rotational thing - So Ferrari & Redbulll for say the first race or two & then another 2 teams? When you think about it, because Ferrari finished down in 4th place this year, they would've been given a smaller pit garage at the races next year... Now with a 3rd car, they will most likely get more room than Mercedes. I guess there are more & more benefits to this when you think about it....

But, if Ferrari is indeed running it throughout the whole season, then had Bianchi not have had that accident, he would've surely been Ferrari's pick for the 3rd car...

Maybe if Kubica gets the last of his surgery done, he can make a late appearance for the final races of next year?

don't remember about 2007, but in 2006 Rubens said Honda was the fastest car in F1 in high speed corners because the car had too much downforce, albeit even more drag, as well, which explains it's poor performance that year.

About engines, Rubens also said, in 2009, that one of the major improvements from Honda to Brawn was the Mercedes engine. He said that it wasn't that Honda lacked power, but the power/torque curve was way worse than the Mercedes and they(Brawn) gained a lot by switching engines.

Honda made great engines in early 90's(Renault only equaled the late 1991 power of Honda in early 93) and apparently they were up to great things when they lastly pulled out, going by that race car engineering article that Stefmeister linked some weeks ago.

I think it would be too much to expect them to be on par with Mercedes but my personal bet is that it will be better than Renault and Ferrari, well, mainly because these two are shite anyway.

The only manufacturer I would bet beating this Mercedes PU would be BMW because they produced the most powerful engines since early 2000s up untill 2008.

It's also worth bearing in mind that the Brawn was designed for the Honda engine and serious work had to be done to fit a Mercedes engine in there, which I remember at the time team personnel saying that would cost them lap time. So any loss from the Honda would've been negated by the fact that it was the engine the car was designed for

Nearly all of Honda's best results over the previous two years (including also the Super Aguri results) came at high-speed circuits or those with long straights. I'm certain that the 2009 car would've been dominant regardless

I agree. According to tech magazines/sites, Honda was always underpowered than the average (Ferrari/Mercedes/Renault) during the entire 2000s decade, but it wasn't by much in 2006-2008 V8 era. With those planned inovations, they could have taken leap in 2009.

We cannot blame Honda solely for the mockery that that team was since the BAR days. They were equally ridiculous under Mercedes power in 2010-2012. Brackley only got it right on very few ocasions.

Well if McLaren and Honda put together a solid package then there's a good chance Alonso could bring home the WDC but it's unlikely that Magnussen would be able to bring home the WCC, which I'm sure would mean a lot more to the team. Alonso-Button would likely deliver it.

lolwut

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Well it's a random discussion so here goes: Christian Horner is getting married to Geri Halliwell. Yes, Geri Halliwell from the Spice Girls.

Just Googled her, well done Christian.

I guess he wanted to spice up his life....

Honda was taking the engine freeze more seriously in the early parts of it, just like Renault was.