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Who wins 2012 Formula One Driver's Championsip?
Sebastian Vettel 65%  65%  [ 64 ]
Fernando Alonso 35%  35%  [ 34 ]
Total votes: 98
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 6:35 pm 
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kals wrote:
RtN wrote:
webbsy wrote:
- he's not taking any responsibility when he makes a mistake Correct me if i'm wrong but did he ever say I stuffed up in Monaco 1988, he packed his things up and went home thats for sure, Adelaide 1992 with Mansell, again I don't believe he said my bad.


Ron Dennis said that Ayrton was extremely angry with himself over the Monaco crash. I wouldn't know about Adelaide.


Considering what we all know about the aftermath of Monaco 1988, Ayrton locking himself in his apartment, hiding from the team, being in tears for many hours after the race, etc... I think it's clear to all he knew he made a mistake.



never knew nothing about him crying in his apartment. only that he jumped off the car and went home to sleep

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 6:43 pm 
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I'm surprised that you did not know that. It's been well documented in books and was in the Senna film.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 6:56 pm 
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kals wrote:
I'm surprised that you did not know that. It's been well documented in books and was in the Senna film.


I read that in a book too (or Galvão Bueno, can't remeber the source). I know that he took a new way into his career after the crash but not in that way

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 7:29 pm 
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Fernando Alonso wrote:
"I don't believe in miracles. I make my miracles out of the correct rules."


Your miracle results in you still losing the world championship. That's a shitty miracle Fernando. Even I can do that one.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 7:44 pm 
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This is one of the top trending articles on Autosport.com today, I had to double-take when I saw the headline...

Autosport.com wrote:
Alonso hopes Raikkonen's title stands

By Pablo Elizalde and Matt Beer Monday, October 22nd 2007, 09:20 GMT

Fernando Alonso believes it would be bad for Formula One if Lewis Hamilton was handed the world championship title via post-race disqualifications.

The outcome of the 2007 championship remains in doubt after McLaren informed the FIA that they would appeal against the race stewards' decision not to penalise Williams' Nico Rosberg and the BMWs in Brazil.

The three drivers finished ahead of Hamilton in fourth, fifth and sixth, but were the subject of a post-race investigation over the temperatures of fuel samples taken from their cars. The officials decided it could not be proved that the fuel had been below the temperature permitted under the regulations and that no action should therefore be taken.

But if McLaren's appeal is successful and the three drivers are penalised, Hamilton could gain enough points to take the world title away from Ferrari's Kimi Raikkonen.

Speaking after news of the investigation into the BMWs and Williams broke, Alonso said Formula One's reputation would be damaged if Raikkonen lost the title because Hamilton was retrospectively promoted to fourth.

"It would be a joke, and we've had too many already," he told Spanish radio station Cadena Ser. "If something like that happened, it would end up burying the sport."

The former champion could only finish a distant third in the Brazilian Grand Prix, and ended the season third in the standings.

He reiterated his belief that McLaren could have been more supportive of his title bid.

"It doesn't seem like the season has been managed very well," Alonso said.

"The result speaks for itself. McLaren lost the championship probably because of some of the decisions they took, especially in the second half of the season. It's no secret that they haven't helped me a lot.

"What my team boss stated in China, saying that they weren't racing against Raikkonen but against me, was a declaration of intent. So McLaren did their part in losing the title, but also Ferrari did a better job than the rest.

"In the last races both my hands and feet have been tied. I didn't have any power. I had to do it all the way they said and that made it harder to close the gap."

But despite his continued criticisms of the team, Alonso denied that he had resolved to leave McLaren, and played down suggestions that he was set for a return to former team Renault.

"I know there are rumours, but I haven't talked to any other team and that's the reality," he insisted.

"If I don't stay at McLaren, I can't say Renault is my first option."

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 8:45 pm 
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ellis wrote:
Fernando Alonso wrote:
"I don't believe in miracles. I make my miracles out of the correct rules."


Your miracle results in you still losing the world championship. That's a shitty miracle Fernando. Even I can do that one.

Looks like you wrote that sentence in 2010? :p


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 9:19 pm 
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Nope. That was the tweet which Fernando made a few days ago, implying that he would become world champion through the miracle of him being the driver who obeys the rules.

Suppose it's a little bit ironic that in the 2003 Brazilian GP Fernando not only ignored yellow flags, but ignored the safety car regulations which resulted in him having a huge accident. An accident which he should've received a multi race ban for. But that might be a miracle is well. It's hard to understand when Fernando is playing mind games and when he's talking complete pish.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 11:22 pm 
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This is how the championship would have ended in the old 10-6-4-3-2-1 scoring system:


Driver's Championship

01 – Sebastian VETTEL – 91 Pts
02 – Fernando ALONSO – 86 Pts
03 – Lewis HAMILTON – 59 Pts
04 – Jenson BUTTON – 59 Pts
05 – Kimi RAIKKONEN – 51 Pts
06 – Mark WEBBER – 49 Pts
07 – Felipe MASSA – 26 Pts
08 – Nico ROSBERG – 22 Pts
09 – Romain GROSJEAN – 19 Pts
10 – Sergio PEREZ – 17 Pts
11 – Pastor MALDONADO – 12 Pts
12 – Kamui KOBAYASHI – 11 Pts
13 – Nico HULKENBERG – 08 Pts
14 – Michael SCHUMACHER – 05 Pts
15 – Paul DI RESTA – 04 Pts
16 – Bruno SENNA – 01 Pt


Constructor's Championship

01 – Red Bull – 140 Pts
02 – McLaren – 118 Pts
03 – Ferrari – 112 Pts
04 – Lotus – 70 Pts
05 – Sauber – 28 Pts
06 – Mercedes – 27 Pts
07 – Williams – 13 Pts
08 – Force India – 12 Pts

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 11:57 pm 
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One Fernando quote from the weekend that did make me chuckle is I'm sure he said that 8th on the grid was the maximum that Ferrari could achieve.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 1:08 am 
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ellis wrote:
Suppose it's a little bit ironic that in the 2003 Brazilian GP Fernando not only ignored yellow flags, but ignored the safety car regulations which resulted in him having a huge accident. An accident which he should've received a multi race ban for. But that might be a miracle is well. It's hard to understand when Fernando is playing mind games and when he's talking complete pish.


I've never understood how alonso escaped punishment for that. Yes he was injured in the crash but that's still the worst example of ignoring yellow flags I've ever seen in f1. Would love to know what radio communication there was, if any, to alonso prior to the crash.

As to what alonso has been saying now, i think its clear he says whatever suits him at the time.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 8:43 am 
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 1:23 pm 
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Lucasjeha wrote:
This is how the championship would have ended in the old 10-6-4-3-2-1 scoring system:


viewtopic.php?p=637885#p637885

;)


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 1:43 pm 
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ellis wrote:
Nope. That was the tweet which Fernando made a few days ago, implying that he would become world champion through the miracle of him being the driver who obeys the rules.

I get your point.
But what fans love about Alonso is this attitude. He never gives up, would do everything for the win and for the title. I know that not everyone appreciates this, but that's the way it is. Senna and Schumacher caused many controversial moments for people to discuss, but I think that Alonso is even another level. Love him or hate him: I love him


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 3:28 pm 
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Regiotap wrote:
Lucasjeha wrote:
This is how the championship would have ended in the old 10-6-4-3-2-1 scoring system:


viewtopic.php?p=637885#p637885

;)

Haven't seen he posted that. Anyway, he hasn't posted the constructos standings. It's very nice to compare the different scoring systems.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 3:32 pm 
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Lucasjeha wrote:
Regiotap wrote:
Lucasjeha wrote:
This is how the championship would have ended in the old 10-6-4-3-2-1 scoring system:


viewtopic.php?p=637885#p637885

;)

Haven't seen he posted that. Anyway, he hasn't posted the constructos standings. It's very nice to compare the different scoring systems.

No, it isn't.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 3:58 pm 
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Why not? If we take the time between 2002-2012 we had 3 different scoring systems, it's many changes for a very short period. It's interesting to see that for an example in a scoring system that only gave points to the first 6, Sauber would be ahead of Mercedes even with Mercedes winning a race and also McLaren would pass Ferrari, mostly due to the difference of victories between those two. Also it's interesting to see that no matter what scoring system, the title would remain to Vettel. I can remember when we changed from 10-6-4-3-2-1 to 10-8-6-5-4-3-2-1 some of the past championships would have different winners and that created a very good discussion about it.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 4:58 pm 
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still looking forward to see 2012 standings under the 9-6-4-3-2-1 system, with the 11 best results counting

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 5:06 pm 
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LucasWheldon wrote:
still looking forward to see 2012 standings under the 9-6-4-3-2-1 system, with the 11 best results counting
That would be nice, but probably Vettel would still win by his higher number of wins in comparison to Alonso. Let's see, Vettel would have 5 wins, 3 2nd places, 2 3rd places and 1 4th place, so it would be 45 + 18 + 8 + 3 = 74 Pts, while Alonso would have 3 wins, 5 2nd places and 3 3rd places, so it would be 27 + 30 + 12 = 69 Pts Vettel would still grab the title.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 5:12 pm 
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yeah, I was expecting that. but is quite different now since it would be counting the 15 best results and not 11

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 6:40 pm 
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Lucasjeha wrote:
Why not? If we take the time between 2002-2012 we had 3 different scoring systems, it's many changes for a very short period. It's interesting to see that for an example in a scoring system that only gave points to the first 6, Sauber would be ahead of Mercedes even with Mercedes winning a race and also McLaren would pass Ferrari, mostly due to the difference of victories between those two. Also it's interesting to see that no matter what scoring system, the title would remain to Vettel. I can remember when we changed from 10-6-4-3-2-1 to 10-8-6-5-4-3-2-1 some of the past championships would have different winners and that created a very good discussion about it.


It's something nice to look at and go "heh, nice", but comparing these systems really serves no point as to actually discussing it. Different point systems would've definitely brought us different races and a different championship battle, since you'd have to race in a completely different way to get just 1 point for example. It's like comparing the Tour de France now with back when they had time bonuses at the end of each stage. Completely different race.


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