2012 Formula 1 ETIHAD AIRWAYS DESTRUCTION DHABI

kals · PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 10:05 pm

The thing is, everytime a driver is lucky in a race there is always a huge discussion about it. I'm pretty sure that was the case post 2008 with Lewis, post Canada 2010 with Button and post Valencia 2012 with Alonso, plus other examples. Why shouldn't it be the same with Vettel? He WAS lucky yesterday, forget the neutral or any other justification.

- The team screwed up in quali, he gets penalized yet RBR is allowed to completely change his setup while the entire field sits in parc ferme
- Vettel hits Senna then swipes a marker board under SC which forces him to pit and switch / optimize his strategy against his competitors
- Running off strategy but with fresher tyres, the second SC allows Vettel to gain ground on field ahead and ultimately positions him to get past Button for third

Let me be clear, it was a great drive and he made some great passes, but there was luck involved and a good portion of it. But it wasn't the stellar / best ever drive I'm reading a lot of hype about.

ellis · PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 12:07 am

Scotty wrote:

Also he had Grosjean, Webber, Hamilton & Massa all fall off the road infront of him.

Grosjean and Webber accident was behind them. And he pitted under the first safety car and restarted last. Why do people keep ignoring this.

Vettels car fails in Valencia. Alonso credited with stunning drive. Why wasn't that one just down to luck? Because of the entire grid of cars Fernado passed?

This is proof that no matter what Vettel does, people will try and discredit him. Yes he made mistakes. Yes there was a well timed safety car. But no matter what you try and say, he started last, and he finished on the podium. He caught his team mate on merit, made several good passes, and minimised the damage which was caused by factors outside of his control. That is exactly how titles are won - through making the best of the situation, and he did just that.

Tom · PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 12:18 am

It's wonderful not really caring about luck and skill and tactics and stuff and just watching it for pure entertainment purposes.

Also, GO KIMI.

But SAFETY CAR!

RtN · PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 12:44 am

acopip wrote:

dicksplaash wrote:

acopip wrote:

Hamilton, the relaxed and nice guy

what?

Right.
He never argues with the team. In the past he did, but now he is so relaxed that I'm actually surprised!
Never saw another driver as relaxed as him. He is always nice and grateful to his team

He knows he only has to put up with it for 2 more weekends. And then it's all over.

It's like Kimi at the end of 2006. He knows he's moving onto better things, and that's a great motivator for a lot of people.

EsbenT · PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 1:51 am

ellis wrote:

a7b7u wrote:

I'm puzzled why the Vettel fanbase goes immediately into attack mode when someone dares to say, Vettel's success yesterday was down to luck. Vettel has his 2nd turn of bad luck in qualifying (just like other competitors like Alonso and Hamilton had bad luck more than ones). The external influence of a total chaos Grand Prix enables him to pull out a very good drive and score an exceptional result. That is luck. Saying this is not belittling his performance.

Rather strange to accuse everyone who mentions the word "luck" of being a bad looser.

They go into attack mode because everything Vettel does is never good enough. It's all the car? Still won when the car wasn't the best. He can't pass? Still passes cars. He can't do well from the back? He finishes 3rd anyway. Hell some people even criticise him for not having a personality! So he gave a brilliant speech at the autosport awards. Meanwhile Fernando is given drive of the year for winning in Valencia, despite being given that win after the dominant car failed. See the imbalance in how we approach drivers here? Yeah there was a bit of luck, but luck didn't give him 20 positions.

If people don't like him, that's cool. But there is always a stream of people waiting to post about how he was lucky and its the car and Lewis and Fernando are better. The amount that we belittle drivers now days is unreal. All this talent on the grid, and we seem to concentrate on trying to tell everyone that other drivers are better.

Honestly, I found this hard to believe. I'm getting really tired of the broken record nature of the Vettel bashing and equally tired of the broken record Vettel fanboyism, or at least fanboy-esque behaviour. So I went to the post-race pages of the Valencia race thread and it certainly seems to be the case. Go and take a look for yourself if you don't believe it either.

Now, in the immortal words of Jules Winnfield from Pulp Fiction, I beg of everyone:

BITCH, BE COOL!

Fabs · PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:11 am

amq55 · PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 11:26 am

Let's just all agree that Vettel is a love-hate kind of guy.

acopip · PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 1:25 pm

ellis wrote:

Vettels car fails in Valencia. Alonso credited with stunning drive. Why wasn't that one just down to luck? Because of the entire grid of cars Fernado passed?

Vettel's drive in Abu Dhabi was as good as Alonso's. Nothing really stunning, but very good.
We expect that from them, that makes it different.
Imagine Massa doing that and everyone would be like: "Wow that was a fantastic drive, best drive ever etc..."
Also, for me Alonso's win in Valencia was great because of the emotions he showed to the audience. That makes his win unforgettable.

cambridge · PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:07 pm

ellis wrote:

The luckiest man in F1 doesn't have to start from the pit lane when the team cocks up the fuel. If anything, Vettels luck throughout the weekend was neutral at best.

neutral? Do you prefer to screw qualy and be the luckiest you can be during race or get a good pole position due to incredible luck and than screw the race?

cambridge · PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:14 pm

ellis wrote:

Not sure why those SCs were lucky for Seb exactly. Pitted under the first one and had to restart last. Only made up 1 place in the second one, and the cars which crashed were already behind him. And his pass on Jenson was skill, not luck.

Whitmarsh might've said it, but he's so amazingly and stunningly full of bullshit that it doesn't matter.

well, the second one was absolutely pure luck: it came out the lap after he stopped to change his worn tyres so he find himself, purely based upon luck, in the position where:

- he has fresh new soft tyres
- three drivers in front have older medium tyres and cant stop anymore cause their time gap is gone
- all the time gap caused by his pit stop vanished thanks to the safety car so he can fight for position with drivers he probably would have never chased.
- he has only 14 laps to go so he can push to the limit on his new soft tyres.

To be honest after he found himself in that position he didnt do anything special he just gained one position.

Evenstar · PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:18 pm

YAYYYYYYYY KIMI DID ITTTTT :8:

O hoi.

cambridge · PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:20 pm

RtN wrote:

He knows he only has to put up with it for 2 more weekends. And then it's all over.

It's like Kimi at the end of 2006. He knows he's moving onto better things, and that's a great motivator for a lot of people.

moving onto better things? has he actually ever seen a Mercedes race? i would be scared to death in his shoes and i would try to catch in the remaining two races my last chance to win a race in formula1 for a big while.

ellis · PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:24 pm

cambridge wrote:

RtN wrote:

He knows he only has to put up with it for 2 more weekends. And then it's all over.

It's like Kimi at the end of 2006. He knows he's moving onto better things, and that's a great motivator for a lot of people.

moving onto better things? has he actually ever seen a Mercedes race? i would be scared to death in his shoes and i would try to catch in the remaining two races my last chance to win a race in formula1 for a big while.

He didn't say better results, he said better things. A team where the team principle doesn't lie every weekend and throw his staff members under a bus and ruin there careers to cover up his own bullshit. That seems like a better thing.

Gaara · PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:25 pm

Evenstar wrote:

YAYYYYYYYY KIMI DID ITTTTT :8:

O hoi.

Haha, knew you'd be bloody happy :lol:

osella 1986 · PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:40 pm

RtN · PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:53 pm

cambridge wrote:

RtN wrote:

He knows he only has to put up with it for 2 more weekends. And then it's all over.

It's like Kimi at the end of 2006. He knows he's moving onto better things, and that's a great motivator for a lot of people.

moving onto better things? has he actually ever seen a Mercedes race? i would be scared to death in his shoes and i would try to catch in the remaining two races my last chance to win a race in formula1 for a big while.

The Mercedes is crap because they've stopped working on it. They have put all their efforts into 2013 when the likes of Red Bull and Ferrari are still churning upgrades out on a weekly basis.

Besides, he can't win in a McLaren either. The team seems incapable of building him a car that works for the whole race.

EAS · PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 3:15 pm

amq55 wrote:

Let's just all agree that Vettel is a love-hate kind of guy.

I think it happens to every guy who keeps himself on the top of the field.

Gael · PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 4:46 pm

Gaara wrote:

Evenstar wrote:

YAYYYYYYYY KIMI DID ITTTTT :8:

O hoi.

Haha, knew you'd be bloody happy :lol:

6 month hiatus, only to be revived by a Kimi win, haha.

phil1993 · PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 8:23 pm

The damage to Narain's HRT
http://ow.ly/i/16bd0

Антон · PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2012 8:51 pm

phil1993 wrote:

The damage to Narain's HRT
http://ow.ly/i/16bd0

looks dangerous

TBK-Light.com

2012 Formula 1 ETIHAD AIRWAYS DESTRUCTION DHABI

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