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agreed on every aspect. I really don't understand how Massa got a penalty for this

Because he is a penis.

WTF? That's laughable. If Massa was taking his racing line and had the corner then there wouldn't have been a car on his inside to collide with. T5 is no place to overtake? That's bollocks. Every corner is a potential overtaking place, given the right circumstances and maturity of the drivers involved.

I can only applaud that.

It's not like Hamilton dive-bombed Massa. He HAD a chance, they were alongside for a moment before a better braking gave Massa half a car advantage.

So this is not another case of a driver sticking his nose in like a twat and hoping for the other to give up the racing line. This is rather the case of a driver closing the door like a twat and hoping for the other to just disappear from his side.

The speed of the corner does not matter, it merely influences whether your twattery is just putting the race result in the balance or also your life. Apparently, Massa and Hamilton have come to a point where none of both matter to them.

I think that pretty much sums up everything, tbh.

Racing incident IMO. Both could have avoided it.

Yeah I suppose Massa shouldn't have turned in if he knew Hamilton might be along side. But by the same token, should Hamilton have stuck his nose up the inside of Massa going into a pretty fast corner? At one point, before they brake, it looks like it might be on for Hamilton, but it relies on him braking later than Massa to be ahead of him going into the turn. Unfortunatly Hamilton braked earlier, and got himself into no mans land. Like I said, they both could have avoided it.

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Hamilton did get far enough alongside. It just didn't look that way because he was trying to back out of it when he realised Massa was going to turn in. I'd say 60 - 40 Massa's fault, but a penalty was farcical.

Both could have done more to avoid it, end of story.

rage much?

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and you can also breathe on the moon, given the right atmosphere.

Fernando

And at times, sensible posts can be written, given the maturity of some forum members...

Indeed, your point being?

I, for one ,have been enjoying all the argy-bargy going on between Hamilton and Massa throughout the year. IMO we could use more of these feuds/rivalries in F1. Even more so because it involves perhaps the oldest rivalry in F1 between Ferrari & McLaren. Plus now it always adds an edge whenever the two are near each other on the track.

Formula One '97 flashback!

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I actually agree with this, but the Massa/Lewis rivalry has been a bit poor really. It hasn't been about the battling for anything, just who has run into who. It can be entertaining, but I miss the days of Hakkinen, Hill and Villeneuve actually having rivalries with Schumacher.

Was there real rivalry between Mika & MS?

Did you watch Spa 2000 for example?

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You might consider that a battle. Rivalry seems to me that you hate you opponents guts...