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I agree with this

SC at both starts were stupid, but the one before the red flag was really needed

Well the SC before the red wasn't really needed, due to the amount of water falling it was fairly obvious they'd need to go straight to red almost immediately yet they persisted with the safety car for whatever reason.
Maybe in these days of "Safety car speed" limiters they wanted all the cars to be slowed down to SC speeds whereas throwing an immediate red risked a chance of the drivers not seeing it due to the amount of rain and crashing.

But then, it's easy to make these calls in hindsight, only Charlie Whiting has to do in ahead of time.

Yes, the cars had fucking awful construction values (especially if you raced in something Chapman built) and the monocoque was surrounded by petrol, two things which thankfully have been driven out of Formula 1.

I re-iterate what I said before; I do not believe a single driver would have supported continuing to race after the cloudburst. They're not that desperate\stupid. But when you have guys like Felipe Massa during the starting SC saying that the spray was OK, it is fine. There was no need for a SC start, they probably could've restarted the race 15-20 minutes earlier, and the SC did not need to be out until it was dry enough for inters when they did restart it. If Jarno Trulli and the others who did not like it (looking at you Rubens) can't handle that, they can park up.

_________________
Dan Wheldon ¦ 1978-2011
Marco Simoncelli ¦ 1987-2011
Jules Bianchi ¦ 1989-2015
Justin Wilson ¦ 1978-2015

Yeah, I know he's mad and I don't care. I do not care. I did not care then. I do not care now. I'm here to race him.

We all know how shitty Massa is in the wet. For him to say it's fine, then its fucking fine.

Yes, but we aren't in 70's..

I definitely agree that the red flag was the right call at the time. It's the SC start and the unnecessary amount of laps at the restart that annoyed me. Is that a one off because no one is used to the Pirelli wets? Or just the way F1 is going? Sadly I think it might be the latter.

Agree with this,
A couple of things to ponder....
think back the last 17 years that F1 has been 'fatalless' for how many crashes would/should/could have been Fatal with a 70's car..
also the amount of fatals that still happen in other formulae that for the common person aren't in the public eye.
(F1 may be safer but Motorsports still dangerous)
What I mean is,we know about them here cause we are all enthusiasts but (for example) I work with a couple of guys that have been to one touring car race and casually watch F1 and now deem themselves experts, yet had no idea that Le Mans was on this weekend, couldn't be bothered going to Oulton park BTCC a couple of weeks ago (our local track) and have no idea that ex F1drivers have careers in racing after they stop in f1 apart from being a TV pundit!

As for the safety car, Isn't there a concern that it too has to be able to circulate at a certain speed?.. Is it not safe if an F1 car is going too slow cause the SC is unable to go fast enough because of adverse weather conditions?
it maybe a supercar but surely its still restricted by grip and visibility.

_________________
I think you should do what you want.

It's your forum and I paid the bills this year..

and if people don't like it they shouldComplain here

I think the death's in the 70s had mostly nothing to do with a wet circuit. Rindt, Cévert, Pryce, even the few in the 80s had nothing to do with a wet track. The severe injury of Pironi in 1982 however was related to a wet track.

SC start of the race: not needed. We will never see a Senna-esque first lap again with that attitude from Charlie.
I agreed that the red flag was needed, but should have been shown much earlier
SC restart after the red flag is ok (I don't know how else this could work), but after 2 laps it should have entered the pits. I don't understand how you can explain that immediately after the SC period most drivers went for inters.

And I want the marshals from Monaco to become professional and to be moved to all circuits. Djeezes, how on earth can it take so long to remove Lewis' car? Or Alonso's? And how amateuristic to clear the debris?

You couldn't be certain that was going to rain so much. So a SC before the red was plausible, also a SC before the Red is also good to bring the field back safely to the S/F line.

The only thing that bothers me is the 10 laps in SC before the starts, that's totally not necessary.

This is going in the HoF, right?

Surely that means Markus Winhelhock is ten times better?

without any doubt, and I am serious. His car was ten times worse.

Surely that makes Markus 100x better.

In the right car in the 2007 Nürburgring conditions he would lap everybody 50 times

Your avatar.

Clip the Apex say there were 127 overtakes in the race and Button did 27 of them

Thought he did more than that haha

it depends really what they mean by overtaking. If someone enteres the pit, and the others move one place up, is that concidered to be a pass? I think it should not.

and what about the situation of Lewis? When he was overtaken by everyone after his incident, is that an on track pass? Or when Alonso was stationary after his incident? Are those concidered to be on track passes?

Can't say I agree with all of these, but if its for the predictions, there has got to be some accuracy

[spoiler]P. Lap. Driver on Driver Position
1. 5 Michael Schumacher Jenson Button 5
2. 5 Lewis Hamilton Jenson Button 6
3. 5 Paul di Resta Vitaly Petrov 9
4. 5 Paul di Resta Nick Heidfeld 8
5. 5 Kamui Kobayashi Pastor Maldonado 11
6. 5 Kamui Kobayashi Vitaly Petrov 10
7. 5 Timo Glock Vitantonio Liuzzi 20
8. 5 Jaime Alguersuari Jerome d'Ambrosio 23
9. 5 Jaime Alguersuari Narain Karthikeyan 22
10. 6 Kamui Kobayashi Nick Heidfeld 8
11. 6 Pastor Maldonado Vitaly Petrov 10
12. 6 Mark Webber Adrian Sutil 13
13. 6 Rubens Barrichello Sebastien Buemi 15
14. 7 Vitaly Petrov Pastor Maldonado 10
15. 7 Mark Webber Pastor Maldonado 11
16. 7 Jarno Trulli Pedro de la Rosa 17
17. 7 Jaime Alguersuari Vitantonio Liuzzi 21
18. 8 Paul di Resta Pastor Maldonado 10
19. 13 Jenson Button Pastor Maldonado 11
20. 13 Jenson Button Paul di Resta 10
21. 13 Pedro de la Rosa Jarno Trulli 16
22. 13 Jaime Alguersuari Timo Glock 19
23. 13 Vitantonio Liuzzi Jerome d'Ambrosio 22
24. 13 Vitantonio Liuzzi Narain Karthikeyan 21
25. 14 Jenson Button Sebastien Buemi 14
26. 14 Jaime Alguersuari Heikki Kovalainen 18
27. 14 Jaime Alguersuari Jarno Trulli 17
28. 15 Mark Webber Vitaly Petrov 8
29. 15 Jenson Button Rubens Barrichello 13
30. 15 Jenson Button Adrian Sutil 12
31. 15 Jenson Button Pastor Maldonado 11
32. 16 Pedro de la Rosa Sebastien Buemi 14
33. 16 Rubens Barrichello Narain Karthikeyan 21
34. 17 Mark Webber Nick Heidfeld 7
35. 17 Heikki Kovalainen Jarno Trulli 16
36. 17 Rubens Barrichello Vitantonio Liuzzi 19
37. 17 Adrian Sutil Vitantonio Liuzzi 20
38. 18 Fernando Alonso Nick Heidfeld 6
39. 18 Jenson Button Paul di Resta 9
40. 18 Rubens Barrichelo Timo Glock 16
41. 18 Rubens Barrichello Jarno Trulli 15
42. 18 Adrian Sutil Pastor Maldonado 18
43. 18 Adrian Sutil Timo Glock 17
44. 18 Pastor Maldonado Timo Glock 18
45. 18 Sebastien Buemi Vitantonio Liuzzi 20
46. 19 Jenson Button Vitaly Petrov 7
47. 19 Vitaly Petrov Jenson Button 7
48. 19 Sebastien Buemi Timo Glock 19
49. 34 Jenson Button Pedro de la Rosa 9
50. 34 Pastor Maldonado Narain Karthikeyan 19
51. 35 Rubens Barrichello Timo Glock 19
52. 35 Sebastien Buemi Timo Glock 20
53. 36 Michael Schumacher Jerome d'Ambrosio 12
54. 36 Michael Schumacher Jarno Trulli 11
55. 36 Michael Schumacher Narain Karthikeyan 10
56. 36 Adrian Sutil Jerome d'Ambrosio 13
57. 36 Adrian Sutil Jarno Trulli 12
58. 36 Jenson Button Jerome d'Ambrosio 14
59. 36 Jenson Button Jarno Trulli 13
60. 36 Jenson Button Adrian Sutil 12
61. 36 Jenson Button Narain Karthikeyan 11
62. 36 Rubens Barrichello Jaime Alguersuari 16
63. 36 Pastor Maldonado Jaime Alguersuari 17
64. 37 Michael Schumacher Vitaly Petrov 7
65. 40 Pastor Maldonado Rubens Barrichello 11
66. 41 Pastor Maldonado Nico Rosberg 10
67. 41 Rubens Barrichello Nico Rosberg 11
68. 41 Pedro de la Rosa Timo Glock 16
69. 41 Jenson Button Vitantonio Liuzzi 20
70. 42 Michael Schumacher Mark Webber 6
71. 42 Rubens Barrichello Pastor Maldonado 10
72. 42 Pedro de la Rosa Jerome d'Ambrosio 15
73. 42 Jenson Button Narain Karthikeyan 19
74. 42 Jenson Button Jarno Trulli 18
75. 43 Timo Glock Jerome d'Ambrosio 15
76. 43 Jenson Button Jerome d'Ambrosio 16
77. 43 Jenson Button Timo Glock 15
78. 43 Jarno Trulli Jerome d'Ambrosio 17
79. 44 Jenson Button Pedro de la Rosa 14
80. 44 Paul di Resta Vitantonio Liuzzi 20
81. 44 Paul di Resta Narain Karthikeyan 19
82. 45 Michael Schumacher Nick Heidfeld 4
83. 45 Nico Rosberg Pastor Maldonado 10
84. 45 Jenson Button Sebastien Buemi 13
85. 45 Paul di Resta Jerome d'Ambrosio 18
86. 46 Paul di Resta Jarno Trulli 17
87. 46 Vitantonio Liuzzi Narain Karthikeyan 20
88. 47 Paul di Resta Timo Glock 16
89. 48 Nico Rosberg Rubens Barrichello 8
90. 48 Jaime Alguersuari Pastor Maldonado 10
91. 49 Jenson Button Pastor Maldonado 11
92. 49 Jenson Button Jaime Alguersuari 10
93. 50 Narain Karthikeyan Vitantonio Liuzzi 19
94. 51 Michael Schumacher Felipe Massa 3
95. 51 Michael Schumacher Kamui Kobayashi 2
96. 51 Felipe Massa Kamui Kobayashi 3
97. 51 Jarno Trulli Timo Glock 15
98. 52 Paul di Resta Pastor Maldonado 13
99. 52 Paul di Resta Jaime Alguersuari 12
100. 54 Jenson Button Nick Heidfeld 5
101. 54 Jaime Alguersuari Nico Rosberg 9
102. 54 Vitantonio Liuzzi Narain Karthikeyan 19
103. 55 Jenson Button Kamui Kobayashi 4
104. 55 Sebastien Buemi Pedro de la Rosa 13
105. 60 Vitantonio Liuzzi Jerome d'Ambrosio 16
106. 61 Vitaly Petrov Kamui Kobayashi 5
107. 61 Jaime Alguersuari Rubens Barrichello 7
108. 61 Nico Rosberg Rubens Barrichello 8
109. 61 Nico Rosberg Jaime Alguersuari 7
110. 61 Felipe Massa Pastor Maldonado 10
111. 61 Felipe Massa Rubens Barrichello 9
112. 61 Paul di Resta Pedro de la Rosa 13
113. 64 Jenson Button Mark Webber 3
114. 64 Vitantonio Liuzzi Timo Glock 14
115. 64 Narain Karthikeyan Jerome d'Ambrosio 16
116. 65 Jenson Button Michael Schumacher 2
117. 65 Felipe Massa Jaime Alguersuari 8
118. 65 Paul di Resta Sebastien Buemi 11
119. 67 Mark Webber Michael Schumacher 3
120. 67 Felipe Massa Nico Rosberg 7
121. 68 Narain Karthikeyan Timo Glock 15
122. 68 Jerome d'Ambrosio Timo Glock 16
123. 70 Jenson Button Sebastian Vettel 1
124. 70 Felipe Massa Kamui Kobayashi 6[/spoiler]

[spoiler]P. Driver Overtaking
1. Jenson Button 27
2. Paul di Resta 12
3. Michael Schumacher 9
4. Jaime Alguersuari 9
5. Rubens Barrichello 8
6. Felipe Massa 6
7. Vitantonio Liuzzi 6
8. Pastor Maldonado 6
9. Mark Webber 5
10. Adrian Sutil 5
11. Sebastien Buemi 4
12. Nico Rosberg 4
13. Pedro de la Rosa 4
14. Vitaly Petrov 3
15. Kamui Kobayashi 3
16. Jarno Trulli 3
17. Narain Karthikeyan 3
18. Timo Glock 2
19. Jerome d'Ambrosio 1
20. Fenando Alonso 1
21. Heikki Kovalainen 1
22. Lewis Hamilton 1[/spoiler]

_________________
Dan Wheldon | 1978 - 2011