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oh yeah because YOU deciding that they shouldn't do a work that they want to do because YOU decide that is degrading for them it's exactly treating them like humans. Because you know they're too stupid to decide for themselves and need YOU to save them from themselves. Stupid me i'm such a misogynist thinking they have a brain and they can decide for themselves if what they volounteer to do is actually degrading or not.

I would never, ever say that they are incapable of making a decision themselves, and if they are personally happy to do that sort of work then that's fine. I'm not going to tell them they are wrong for wanting to do that as a career, as long as they are comfortable and satisifed.

However, it is possible for people to be happy to do a particular job that still has a long-term negative impact. Even if every model who ever chose the work as a grid girl was absolutely satisfied with that choice, and had no hangups on the long-term impact it may have on the portrayal of a woman's role in F1, that doesn't prevent damage being done.

To flip it around a bit, I'm sure in the past there have been dangerous and risky jobs performed by people who were perfectly willing and happy to continue doing that work, despite the risks, but had that role removed from them in the interests of preventing long-term harm being caused.

'Who decided this job was too dangerous for me?' 'This was my only revenue stream!' 'I'm capable of deciding to do the job without having someone tell me it's no good for me.'

Basically, people being happy to do a job doesn't stop that job from being harmful in some way or another, and if as result of harm being identified that job role becomes unfashionable or undesirable for the employer to promote as in any market-based scenario, then those people may need to adapt or diversify to continue doing what they (validly) love to do.

Of course, the issue in this case isn't quite as black or white because it's a societal/social perception which is vastly subjective; who decides what harm is caused by having grid girls and then quantifies it in a manner that allows a determination on whether there's 'too much' caused to justify allowing it to continue? Cynics will say that Liberty Media are simply trying to score brownie points with this gesture to win a smattering of new viewers (while simultaneously putting it behind a pay wall and siphoning off poorer viewers). Others will scoff at the 'politically correct liberal snowflake bleeding heart do-gooder' brigade and accuse them of having far more power than they actually have.

It's very likely that the decision isn't being made on the back of detailed research investigating the cultural impact of portraying women in F1 in this way, and it's very likely not backed up by the canvassing of the grid girls themseves, which in an ideal world both of which would have been done first and presented as part of the decision making process.

And yes, I have a penis and therefore, as @

Gaara pointed out, the actual impact and reaction to a small change like this will fly waaaaay over my head.

But if I had to pick a side of the fence to fall on at the end of the day, having no regard to any offered reasonings behind the decision, I'd say it was the right one.

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RantingYoof

by the way if you want some 1st hand accounts, those girls doesn't feel more empowered now or happy to be finally liberated:

https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comme ... s/dtiogeo/

http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/article/4 ... -grid-girl

but what can i know, i'm just a mysoginist troll

by the way i'm pretty sure F1 will now announce that marshalls, without whom races wouldn't be possible, will be finally paid for their work and not be volunteers anymore. Or unpaid jobs are still in line with the new f1 sensibility?
Yeah why not take the opportunity to address this problem: I feel having people working 12 hours a day for a week under the pouring rain or cooking sun and risking their lives completely for free is much more degrading than going around in high heels and tight shorts. Can we talk about this for a moment?

I agree with everything you say apart from the last line, but we'll agree to disagree there. Although having said that, I do agree the image of those women lining the corridor applauding the drivers at the end of the race was cringeworthy at best.

But hey, at the end of the day if this means FOM won't also subject us to random shots of whatever Z list celebrity standing in the garage during the race, because you know, pointing a camera at said celebrity is just as objectifying them sexually as pointing a camera at the "grid girl" pre-race, especially when said celebrity sits provocatively or waves/reacts to the camera, and it results in us being able to watch the race without being subjected to random shots of Kim Kardashian or Kelly Piquet then it's fine by me. What's good for goose etc...

Instead of just getting rid of them, let each Grand Prix decide what to do with it.

It could be men/women in historical costumes from the country, or disabled having the day of their live being on the grid, or make it some kind of contest that you can win being standing there. I'd be happy to stand there on the grid close to a F1 car for a couple of hours. Or children from a school.

So many options.

To even get to a grid girl spot is hard,as I heard,and they get the chance to be seen not just as sexual objects like 2018 is telling us we are seeing it,but they get noticed in the job branche-modelling,they decided to do. So they get noticed and paid, no one is telling them to do it.

It's horrible these days everyone gets offended for anything. Like someone said, girls come out with shorter skirts, you watch them, you are a pervert and they are sexually offended.
I do not like that they are so many perverts out there. But a normal person, would it be a man or women like to see the opposite gender looking good and handsome.
Or even the same gender,but that's the choice,if I say that I don't like it but the homosexual people should just take care of their business and do not come out in media so much so no one would even care and have such resistance to it,I would be considered a offender in 2018.

To be honest,my job should be very well paid or less paid but that I like it. There has to be balance between money and satisfaction, if you get more money, you could buy yourself a bit more and travel more,or do the thing you like. So to conclude,if the girls liked and got noticed,it was surely good for them. I don't care much about that in F1, didn't seen them much pre race,but it's something like an image for a sport and good chance for the girls to get noticed in a job they are doing-and they chose to do.

And as I'm reading the girls are earning so much for the 4 days, it is tiring, but it's good paid, so they decide to do it again,because 4 days is really a good chance.

And the final thing, the same thing in the spectator area, and paddock,someone has to do it, they will do the same job but just chance their dresses and do the same shit in different clothes

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https://www.youtube.com/user/Alonsofanscro

This is the most sensible post I've read on the discussion. Although it may just be that I agree with everything you've said.

I agree with others about the line of women applauding the drivers on their way to the podium. That is cringeworthy and won't be missed. Losing grid girls completely? I'm still on the fence.

Well said.

well said? he contradicts himself 4 times in 4 tweets.
aside from that i hate people that cut their messages on twitter in multiple parts. If it's called twitter and there's a character's limit it's all for a reason. If you can't make it in 280 char than it's probably not something that belongs on twitter, there are so many platforms to chose.

Bernie fucked that by negotiating which brands the grid girls would advertise at the races

I still believe that they're doing the right thing by ditching grid girls, but they must also do more for the racing aswell

most of the problem is related to the crowd, with drunken fools shouting profanity to the girls to display a false sense of manhood, just like in auto shows when they hire models to stay aside the cars and some idiots start asking "does the girl comes with the car?"

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Motorsports trend for 2024: everything is a bad taste joke now

It is a choice of yours to pick who you listen to. You can pick the women who are losing their gigs, but you can also pick some female fans and ask what they are thinking of this. All my friends who like F1 celebrated the decision, for example.

In regards to the gigs that are no more there. We must remember people do their jobs because they want (or they resignedly accept because they need) and also because there is a demand for it. Unless we are deliberately helping someone, we hire people because we need them, not because for charity or whatsoever.

Times change and we won't keep typists or lamplighters around just for them not to be unemployed.

So they are pushing the start times for races back

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/head ... -2018.html

whats the use of that 10 minute later start time??? I really dont get it. Its such a weird number

long story short, they can squash in 10 minutes more of commercials for those networks that started tv broadcasting right at the hour. it actually makes sense.

damn I must wait till daylight saving time end here and begin in Europe to adjust everything. shit got very confusing

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Motorsports trend for 2024: everything is a bad taste joke now

This. Plus it's also about some TV networks starting their coverage at the top of the hour, at the start of the parade lap. Liberty wants them to include some additional build up.

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Formula Fun Cup Champion 2013
http://www.the-fastlane.co.uk

This. I don't care if there are grid girls or not. It's about habits that worked out fine for years and years, and suddenly it's not appropriate anymore so it has to go without further sense. It's about not being able to breath anymore because someone might get offended by it. It's about saying "dear people" instead of "ladies and gentlemen" because 1 in 10.000.000 might not feel man/female and make a fuss about it. It's about not being able to say Fuck but F*** (yeah, that really helps). It's about miserable people who get up in the morning, read the paper and look for something to get offended about because a day not complained is a day not lived.

it's even worse. It's people deciding what other people should be offended by or should feel degraded by. Like in this very case, very few people are saying "i'm personally offended by grid girls, grid girls disturb me" the majority of comments you read around are saying "grid girls should feel degraded and offended and should be glad this is finally over" and when you read it's mostly males telling women what they should feel it's degrading for them. And these men genuinely feel they're being pro-women in doing that.
It's like a soft-core versions of the talibans forcing women to wear burqas cause they feel is degrading for them to show skins.

This is not bull fighting where the bull is killed and has no voice or can't defend himself therefore needs someone to speak for him.

How did he contradict himself?

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