2014-2015 Silly Season

kals · PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2014 1:56 pm

It was Magnussen's first year in F1. The car was a dog most of the time and it shouldn't be unnatural for him to have performed inconsistently. Not everyone comes into F1 and performs like JV or Hamilton. Even Jenson in 2000 was up and down, and he had tons of testing. Let's cut these new drivers some slack.

micha · PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2014 1:57 pm

Gaara wrote:

Mags is still too rough around the edges to be consistent, another reason small teams will always be needed.

Next year the strongest pairing for McLaren would be Alonso and Button, though both are nearing the end of their careers.

What I don't understand is that none of the bigger teams follow Red Bull's example and use junior teams. With the demise of Caterham and Marussia there where 2 relative cheap ways to get one.
And McLaren already played with the idea back in the day with Jean Alesi and Direxiv.

kals · PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2014 2:47 pm

Probably not the best example. Direxiv was bankrolling that scheme (not McLaren, they just supported the idea of it) and it turned out to be a bit of a farce. But teams have been involved in junior schemes in the past. It doesn't always work. Firstly (and probably most importantly), money needs to come from somewhere to support these schemes. Why would an F1 team support an entire team when they can fund a driver fully or perhaps partially? Secondly, F1 has a history of teams putting junior drivers in other teams cars. Ricciardo was the last such example when Red Bull placed him in the HRT in 2011.

Schumifan · PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2014 3:59 pm

kals wrote:

It was Magnussen's first year in F1. The car was a dog most of the time and it shouldn't be unnatural for him to have performed inconsistently. Not everyone comes into F1 and performs like JV or Hamilton. Even Jenson in 2000 was up and down, and he had tons of testing. Let's cut these new drivers some slack.

This. It's almost like if you're not competing for a championship and/or trouncing your vastly more experienced team mate in your first year you're declared a failure. Magnussen is only going to get better. Button is only going to get worse. I think it'd be very short sighted of Mclaren to drop Magnussen.

WilliamsF1 · PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:10 pm

The situation brings back memories of 2005 & Williams. Mark Webber had been confirmed, but even up until the launch of the car to the studio audience (Febuary), the team had not announced their second driver. It was between Heidfeld & Pizzonia. The official word is that Frank Williams only decided minutes before they came out on stage to the waiting media, who the second driver would be (Heidfeld) but I personally suspect he had decided who he wanted, & only wanted to hang onto the sponsors from South America, but thats another story.

Could this happen again?

LucasWheldon · PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:42 pm

I remember in 2004-05 that Button was having several legal issues with BAR and Williams, saying that he already signed a contract with Williams while still with BAR, looking for a potential winning seat. Eventually BAR won and he stayed there until Honda deceased

kals · PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2014 5:51 pm

LucasWheldon wrote:

I remember in 2004-05 that Button was having several legal issues with BAR and Williams, saying that he already signed a contract with Williams while still with BAR, looking for a potential winning seat. Eventually BAR won and he stayed there until Honda deceased

Both of those situations happened mid-season. In both cases, Jenson lost out. In 2005 CRB recognised that Button had a legally binding contract with BAR for 2005, whereas in 2006 the CRV recognised that Jenson had a legally binding contract with Williams for 2006. Those episodes cost Jenson a great deal of money. The latter especially.

codename_47 · PostPosted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:01 am

Schumifan wrote:

kals wrote:

It was Magnussen's first year in F1. The car was a dog most of the time and it shouldn't be unnatural for him to have performed inconsistently. Not everyone comes into F1 and performs like JV or Hamilton. Even Jenson in 2000 was up and down, and he had tons of testing. Let's cut these new drivers some slack.

This. It's almost like if you're not competing for a championship and/or trouncing your vastly more experienced team mate in your first year you're declared a failure. Magnussen is only going to get better. Button is only going to get worse. I think it'd be very short sighted of Mclaren to drop Magnussen.

Lets face it, a year behind the rest of the engine manufacturers means Honda won't be winning any titles next year.
Even Alonso has alluded to this about the challenge of building something with Honda for his future (or maybe he just wants a one year contract so he'd be free in 2016 if Mercedes can't come to terms with Lewis-who knows)
So what is required from next year's driver is someone who is experienced at developing a car.
This leans towards Jenson's strengths rather than a young driver.

And I know times are different and F1 has become even more youth oriented than it was then, but even Fernando himself took a year out test driving in 2002 after a promising debut year with Minardi in 2001, so it's not the end of the world if Kevin has to do this.
Or as suggested, they send Caterham some money to help them so long as they run Kevin and Stoffel next year

LucasWheldon · PostPosted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 5:05 pm

codename_47 wrote:

but even Fernando himself took a year out test driving in 2002 after a promising debut year with Minardi in 2001, so it's not the end of the world if Kevin has to do this.

well, seeing by the ammount of testing, it could be the end of the world, unless he drives in all free practices

Talladega · PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 12:51 am

Just heard the news about Vergne... That's a shame.
Once again, Red Bull is proving that they are just in F1 for the money. They struck gold with Vettel, and Ricciardo is a top driver, but good luck selling Infinity cars to Russia's shit economy when most teams around you are improving and you prioritize marketing over performance.

France goes from 3 drivers on the grid to probably 0. One lost to a tragic accident, another one gone with its team and the third one lost because he doesn't have monies or a Russian passport. Shame.

kals · PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 3:49 am

Red Bull don't care how many, if any Infinitis are sold to Russian consumers. They do care about how much Red Bull is sold to Russian consumers though.

You say France is going from 3 to probably 0 drivers. So what about Grosjean then?

Fabs · PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 2:40 pm

noikeee · PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 3:03 pm

Well, Grosjean was actually born a Swiss.

acopip · PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 3:14 pm

Talladega wrote:

France goes from 3 drivers on the grid to probably 0. One lost to a tragic accident, another one gone with its team and the third one lost because he doesn't have monies or a Russian passport. Shame.

I think he was referring to Grosjean going down as Lotus goes down.
If I am correct, I would disagree with that. Grosjean would probably find another seat.

LucasWheldon · PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 3:38 pm

a brazilian website have a font that got some right guesses that Alonso is already confirmed at McLaren

the get so pedantic with this kind of thing that might be very funny if doesn't happen

micha · PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 3:42 pm

acopip wrote:

Talladega wrote:

France goes from 3 drivers on the grid to probably 0. One lost to a tragic accident, another one gone with its team and the third one lost because he doesn't have monies or a Russian passport. Shame.

I think he was referring to Grosjean going down as Lotus goes down.
If I am correct, I would disagree with that. Grosjean would probably find another seat.

at this point? where? Only real empty seats are over at McLaren and I doubt the delay is because Lotus can go bust any moment.

siggy · PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 4:15 pm

Did I miss something? I thought Alonso was confirmed weeks ago.

micha · PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 4:15 pm

Nope. Nothing is official yet.

siggy · PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 4:18 pm

Okay thanks. Doubtful that Honda will let him slip, but it would kinda be cool to let him sit out a season. Not good for the quality of the grid, but fun for the politics. It's just another side show

Omega · PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 5:39 pm

I think the delay is to see how he can combine it with driving in WEC or something

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