TBK-Light.com :: Fuck you, NASCAR

I've pretty much limited my NASCAR intake to Cup races now. Nationwide and Truck viewing has been reduced to the superspeedway clusterfucks, road course shenanigans, and Eldora. As I've noted a few pages back, it's not even so much Busch/Kez/Logano spanking the field for the millionth time as it is the racing in general just being dull, and in some cases downright terrible. Even when young guys I root for like Chase Elliott, Kyle Larson, Erik Jones, Darrell Wallace, etc. shine without the stench of Cup guys pissing on their parade, I still can't be bothered.

Hell, I didn't even realize Chase Elliott had an insurmountable points lead going into Phoenix, because I've literally haven't checked the standings since early June. That's how much I care.

NASCAR has been a part of my life since I was 4. I've seen its highs and lows. I watched my hero go from riding on his roof at Daytona in '97 to finally winning it all in '98. I booed Jeff Gordon like the rest of the Earnhardt fan collective when that rainbow car pulled into victory lane. I went nuts watching Dale punt Terry at Bristol in '99. I watched my hero die on live national television. I saw a kid name Harvick rise from those ashes to win on an emotional day at Atlanta. I felt joy watching Dale Jr return to Daytona in July to stand victorious. I rooted for Jimmy Spencer to beat the dogshit out of Kurt Busch. The Craven/Busch barnburner at Darlington. The Kahne/Kenseth battle at Rockingham. Sadler flying at Dega in back-to-back years. Going to my first race at Homestead in '04 and returning every year since. That same little shit that booed Gordon 15 years ago was left frustrated when he was knocked out of the championship hunt, knowing he may not have too many more chances at #5.

Limited my viewing? Yes. But frankly, I've spent too much of my life loving this sport to give up on it now. There is a light at the end of the tunnel, and I can only hope I'll be watching when they get there.

I don't think Texas was a black eye at all. How was it different from Daytona 1979?

I honestly think the best driver/team of the modern era has been obscured by the sport's attempts to be "exciting".

Philthy82 wrote:

I honestly think the best driver/team of the modern era has been obscured by the sport's attempts to be "exciting".

A 'best' driver/team adapts. Stewart adapted and won championships in both the old and holy 'stroke as you go' Winston system as well as this evil, evil Chase. Gordo couldn't. Complaining about it only makes it look like you're finding excuses for your driver.

SB83 wrote:

Philthy82 wrote:

I honestly think the best driver/team of the modern era has been obscured by the sport's attempts to be "exciting".

Except the old non-chase system is arguably the better system for rewarding the best driver and team year round. Want to know which driver is best at the last 10 races of the year? Great, the chase is your system. Want to know which driver is best overall across the season, including road courses, Pocono, Bristol, Daytona? Then the chase is a heap of shit.

If the 'best' driver/team adapts, then holy shit Denny Hamlin and Ryan Newman are good. How they managed to run like dirt for most of the year, not winning and even missing a race, then became experts at consistency the last 10 races? Yep, they truly are the best.

You'll never sell me on Kenseth being the best driver of 2003 nor Labonte being the best of 1996 (or even 1984) and so on. Every championship system has its flaws and the Winston system favored strokers and punished bad races very heavily. Now you've got a system that gives you both options. Stroke your way to Homestead like Newman or win when the pressure's at its highest and move ahead that way. And it's worked. 2 of the final 4 have nine wins between them while the other 2 got there mostly on consistency, which should please those who liked to see strokers win championships. Win-win.

Author:	Wayne [ Wed Nov 12, 2014 7:50 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Fuck you, NASCAR
Cartman wrote: I've pretty much limited my NASCAR intake to Cup races now. Nationwide and Truck viewing has been reduced to the superspeedway clusterfucks, road course shenanigans, and Eldora. As I've noted a few pages back, it's not even so much Busch/Kez/Logano spanking the field for the millionth time as it is the racing in general just being dull, and in some cases downright terrible. Even when young guys I root for like Chase Elliott, Kyle Larson, Erik Jones, Darrell Wallace, etc. shine without the stench of Cup guys pissing on their parade, I still can't be bothered. Hell, I didn't even realize Chase Elliott had an insurmountable points lead going into Phoenix, because I've literally haven't checked the standings since early June. That's how much I care. You're about in the same boat as me. I'm sure a lot of others are, too.

Author:	movingunit [ Wed Nov 12, 2014 9:16 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Fuck you, NASCAR
Cartman wrote: I've pretty much limited my NASCAR intake to Cup races now. Nationwide and Truck viewing has been reduced to the superspeedway clusterfucks, road course shenanigans, and Eldora. As I've noted a few pages back, it's not even so much Busch/Kez/Logano spanking the field for the millionth time as it is the racing in general just being dull, and in some cases downright terrible. Even when young guys I root for like Chase Elliott, Kyle Larson, Erik Jones, Darrell Wallace, etc. shine without the stench of Cup guys pissing on their parade, I still can't be bothered. That pretty much sums it up for me as well.

Author:	SBan83 [ Wed Nov 12, 2014 9:32 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Fuck you, NASCAR
I'm the same way but I had even cut down on Cup races but once the Chase got nearer and nearer, I've been watching every race religiously. And while Nationwide is a lost cause on anywhere but the SS and roadies, I still try and tune in for every truck race, regardless of track or shrub due to the plethora of fresh faces that either show early signs of greatness or provide lulz like 3 cautions before 2 laps of green.

Author:	Dan Belcher [ Wed Nov 12, 2014 3:21 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Fuck you, NASCAR
I pretty much haven't watched NASCAR this year. I saw most of the plate races (missed the Firecracker 400 entirely though) and watched a few minutes here and there of the other events. I've actively avoided the Nationwide and Truck races for the most part. They're just hot garbage anymore.

Author:	Temiree [ Thu Nov 13, 2014 1:36 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Fuck you, NASCAR
For me, the product just isn't good enough for me to be willing to sink hours of my time into every weekend. I don't find the racing particularly entertaining to watch unless it's down to the last 10-20 laps. I tend to watch more if it's a road course or superspeedway, but I dread places like 1.5 milers. At the most I have a race on in the background while I do something else. The first 26 races matter less than they ever have before in the Cup series, and it's sort of a crapshoot who wins the championship now. The lower series are dominated by Cup drivers I don't care for, or completely dislike. I had no idea what the championship standings were for the Nationwide and Truck series until I heard that Chase Elliot locked up the Nationwide championship, and then felt compelled to see who was winning in Trucks. The racing itself isn't fun to watch. The cars don't feel on edge. It doesn't feel like the drivers are fighting for every piece of grip they can get, if that makes sense. And so many other things that have already been mentioned. I don't know what it'd take me to completely stop watching. I barely actively watch anymore as it is, though.

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Author:	Tommy Vercetti [ Thu Nov 13, 2014 2:13 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Fuck you, NASCAR
I haven't watched a race in full since Talladega and my Sundays are split between the usual laundry and NFL football (thanks to DraftKings and especially NFL RedZone). Even when there's nothing on but NASCAR, I can't put forth an effort to watch it. The only races that I'm willing to watch are IndyCar races because it's more entertaining, the only BS that's going on are among the higher-ups (tho, not as bad as NASCAR's), it's friendlier to the fans, and affordable. Grand National and Trucks, I stopped caring completely, bar a road course race, a typical superspeedway colossal fuck-up, and Eldora. Cuppies are running rampant, the point system does not reflect consistency because of the Cup drivers being outliers...not to mention the racing is just not engaging to me. Matter of fact, when word got out that Chase Elliot clinched the GN title, I didn't even think that he was in contention for the title. That's how much I paid attention to the points. I'm probably echoing what everyone else was saying, but that's my situation. Yes, the sport has to evolve and yes, they have to adapt to modern times, but this is a case of a sanctioning body doing too much, confusing the hell out of the casual fan and alienating the core fanbase.

Author:	Andre [ Thu Nov 13, 2014 7:56 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Fuck you, NASCAR
I will tune in to the occasional Nationwide race, so long as it's a stand-alone event without Kyle or Brad, or at a roadie and plate track. Trucks I'll watch if Kyle Busch isn't running, since the on-track product seems to be even better than Cup races - the problem is, I don't have any channels to watch it on... I'm not terribly heart-broken by this, however. Cup races, I still make time to watch no matter what. If there's a race on and I'm not there to see it, I make every effort to catch a radio feed. In this day and age of consistently boring races, I can't bring myself to miss any of them. I always hold out hope that one race will be better than the last, and although it seems a bit silly that that's what I'm holding onto, it actually pays off whenever something crazy happens. Granted, shit like what happened at Texas is a BIIIG black eye, but that shit heals. It's still the pinnacle of stock car racing, and even through all its faults, it's a form of racing I still hold way above IndyCar and Formula One in terms of excitement (although IndyCar is improving - holy competition, Batman). I've been a fan for 20 years now, and I definitely know it's not perfect at the moment. I'd just rather watch than not watch. Hockey is the only other sport that matters, but since games are on every single day, NASCAR is the only thing that makes Sundays special. shrugs

Author:	SBan83 [ Thu Nov 13, 2014 8:11 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Fuck you, NASCAR
I don't think Texas was a black eye at all. How was it different from Daytona 1979?

Author:	Wreckinturn4 [ Thu Nov 13, 2014 8:32 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Fuck you, NASCAR
well there was no difference between them. infact, texas '14 was way better. the guys in daytona '79 were honestly a bunch of pussy ass bitches. these days if you race someone a little too hard, you get your nose smashed in by his pitcrew. how cool is that? I couldn't ask for more as a nascar fan

Author:	Cartman [ Thu Nov 13, 2014 8:42 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Fuck you, NASCAR
NASCAR has been a part of my life since I was 4. I've seen its highs and lows. I watched my hero go from riding on his roof at Daytona in '97 to finally winning it all in '98. I booed Jeff Gordon like the rest of the Earnhardt fan collective when that rainbow car pulled into victory lane. I went nuts watching Dale punt Terry at Bristol in '99. I watched my hero die on live national television. I saw a kid name Harvick rise from those ashes to win on an emotional day at Atlanta. I felt joy watching Dale Jr return to Daytona in July to stand victorious. I rooted for Jimmy Spencer to beat the dogshit out of Kurt Busch. The Craven/Busch barnburner at Darlington. The Kahne/Kenseth battle at Rockingham. Sadler flying at Dega in back-to-back years. Going to my first race at Homestead in '04 and returning every year since. That same little shit that booed Gordon 15 years ago was left frustrated when he was knocked out of the championship hunt, knowing he may not have too many more chances at #5. Limited my viewing? Yes. But frankly, I've spent too much of my life loving this sport to give up on it now. There is a light at the end of the tunnel, and I can only hope I'll be watching when they get there.

Author:	ChrisTRD [ Thu Nov 13, 2014 9:22 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Fuck you, NASCAR
Cartman wrote: NASCAR has been a part of my life since I was 4. I've seen its highs and lows. I watched my hero go from riding on his roof at Daytona in '97 to finally winning it all in '98. I booed Jeff Gordon like the rest of the Earnhardt fan collective when that rainbow car pulled into victory lane. I went nuts watching Dale punt Terry at Bristol in '99. I watched my hero die on live national television. I saw a kid name Harvick rise from those ashes to win on an emotional day at Atlanta. I felt joy watching Dale Jr return to Daytona in July to stand victorious. I rooted for Jimmy Spencer to beat the dogshit out of Kurt Busch. The Craven/Busch barnburner at Darlington. The Kahne/Kenseth battle at Rockingham. Sadler flying at Dega in back-to-back years. Going to my first race at Homestead in '04 and returning every year since. That same little shit that booed Gordon 15 years ago was left frustrated when he was knocked out of the championship hunt, knowing he may not have too many more chances at #5. Limited my viewing? Yes. But frankly, I've spent too much of my life loving this sport to give up on it now. There is a light at the end of the tunnel, and I can only hope I'll be watching when they get there. I am right there with you. Been watching religiously since Daytona '93. I was a Rusty fan so I was used to wins but never saw that championship. When Rusty retired following 2005, I had no idea what to do. Do I stick with the 2 car or switch to up and coming Kasey Kahne. My gf at the time was a Kahne fan. I eventually realized I couldn't keep from looking to see where the 2 car was so then began my cheering for Kurt Busch. When he left the 2 for the 22, I became a fan of both him and Brad and still am to this day. I finally saw that 2 car get that championship and I was insanely thrilled that day. It was like I was 8 or 9 years old all over again. These days I don't watch a lot of the Truck races and half the Nationwide races. I usually watch all but 2 Cup races a year. During late summer and fall, a lot are on DVR. The Truck races--sorry but they bore the fuck out of me. I just don't see "this is the best racing in NASCAR" when I watch. The Nationwide races--I watch but unless it's a SS or roadie, it's just on in the background. The Cup races, I still get super excited for them. As Cartman said, I've invested way too much of my life (7yrs old - 30yrs old) to turn away now. I love everything about it and will continue to watch until I go blind.... then I will switch to MRN.

Author:	Philthy82 [ Fri Nov 14, 2014 12:08 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Fuck you, NASCAR
This is purely a Gordon fan viewpoint, but I remember getting into the sport in '94 when I was 12 and quickly becoming a 24 fan. I remember the goals they posted on the team HQ walls: 1. Contender 2. Champion 3. Dynasty. The last one referred to matching Earnhardt and Petty in championships. At the time I wondered if they could really do it. I've stayed a Gordon fan because over 2 decades he's found a way to consistently stay at the top with the same team. And it just kills me to think he would legitimately be close to or have achieved that Dynasty goal, if not for NASCAR's Chase bullshit over the last 10 years. I honestly think the best driver/team of the modern era has been obscured by the sport's attempts to be "exciting". Probably seems like a petty reason to a lot of you, but that's a big part of why I'm fed up with NASCAR.

Author:	the ost [ Fri Nov 14, 2014 12:49 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Fuck you, NASCAR
SB83 wrote: I don't think Texas was a black eye at all. How was it different from Daytona 1979? Good lord.

Author:	Starlancer [ Fri Nov 14, 2014 1:25 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Fuck you, NASCAR
It's rather fair that this bullshit is happening at the 10 year mark of the chase. A decade of bullshit.

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Author:	SBan83 [ Fri Nov 14, 2014 4:56 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Fuck you, NASCAR
Philthy82 wrote: I honestly think the best driver/team of the modern era has been obscured by the sport's attempts to be "exciting". A 'best' driver/team adapts. Stewart adapted and won championships in both the old and holy 'stroke as you go' Winston system as well as this evil, evil Chase. Gordo couldn't. Complaining about it only makes it look like you're finding excuses for your driver.

Author:	Philthy82 [ Fri Nov 14, 2014 5:14 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Fuck you, NASCAR
SB83 wrote: Philthy82 wrote: I honestly think the best driver/team of the modern era has been obscured by the sport's attempts to be "exciting". A 'best' driver/team adapts. Stewart adapted and won championships in both the old and holy 'stroke as you go' Winston system as well as this evil, evil Chase. Gordo couldn't. Complaining about it only makes it look like you're finding excuses for your driver. Except the old non-chase system is arguably the better system for rewarding the best driver and team year round. Want to know which driver is best at the last 10 races of the year? Great, the chase is your system. Want to know which driver is best overall across the season, including road courses, Pocono, Bristol, Daytona? Then the chase is a heap of shit. If the 'best' driver/team adapts, then holy shit Denny Hamlin and Ryan Newman are good. How they managed to run like dirt for most of the year, not winning and even missing a race, then became experts at consistency the last 10 races? Yep, they truly are the best.

Author:	mclaren2008 [ Fri Nov 14, 2014 6:06 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Fuck you, NASCAR
Just to demonstrate how fucked up this Chase really is, if Denny Hamlin "wins" the championship, he will be the first one since Richard Petty in 1971 to win it without running in every race.

Author:	SBan83 [ Fri Nov 14, 2014 10:52 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Fuck you, NASCAR
Philthy82 wrote: SB83 wrote: Philthy82 wrote: I honestly think the best driver/team of the modern era has been obscured by the sport's attempts to be "exciting". A 'best' driver/team adapts. Stewart adapted and won championships in both the old and holy 'stroke as you go' Winston system as well as this evil, evil Chase. Gordo couldn't. Complaining about it only makes it look like you're finding excuses for your driver. Except the old non-chase system is arguably the better system for rewarding the best driver and team year round. Want to know which driver is best at the last 10 races of the year? Great, the chase is your system. Want to know which driver is best overall across the season, including road courses, Pocono, Bristol, Daytona? Then the chase is a heap of shit. If the 'best' driver/team adapts, then holy shit Denny Hamlin and Ryan Newman are good. How they managed to run like dirt for most of the year, not winning and even missing a race, then became experts at consistency the last 10 races? Yep, they truly are the best. You'll never sell me on Kenseth being the best driver of 2003 nor Labonte being the best of 1996 (or even 1984) and so on. Every championship system has its flaws and the Winston system favored strokers and punished bad races very heavily. Now you've got a system that gives you both options. Stroke your way to Homestead like Newman or win when the pressure's at its highest and move ahead that way. And it's worked. 2 of the final 4 have nine wins between them while the other 2 got there mostly on consistency, which should please those who liked to see strokers win championships. Win-win.

Author:	Gaara [ Fri Nov 14, 2014 1:07 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Fuck you, NASCAR
Well if Newman hadn't crashed out of every other race in '03 he'd have won the title.

Author:	Dan Belcher [ Fri Nov 14, 2014 1:21 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Fuck you, NASCAR
SB83 wrote: You'll never sell me on Kenseth being the best driver of 2003 nor Labonte being the best of 1996 (or even 1984) and so on. Every championship system has its flaws and the Winston system favored strokers and punished bad races very heavily. Now you've got a system that gives you both options. Stroke your way to Homestead like Newman or win when the pressure's at its highest and move ahead that way. And it's worked. 2 of the final 4 have nine wins between them while the other 2 got there mostly on consistency, which should please those who liked to see strokers win championships. Win-win. Talking about being punished for bad races??? Look at this bullshit excuse for a "playoff" NASCAR's using this year. If you blow a right front tire during the Chase (which is highly likely thanks to Goodyear), you're completely, totally, utterly fucked. Nevermind the entire rest of the season and how well you ran. One bad result -- whether your fault or not -- completely negates the entire rest of your season. At least in a full season championship those bad breaks tend to even out more fairly over 36 races for all of the drivers.