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Do these changes...
Negatively affect your love of the sport? 74%  74%  [ 86 ]
Positively affect your love of the sport? 9%  9%  [ 10 ]
Make no change at all. 17%  17%  [ 20 ]
Total votes: 116
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 2:23 am 
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The point that we should all wait and see how the season turns out before passing judgement is as silly as the hypotheticals about retiring from half the races and winning the WDC. Do some of you honestly think these things shouldn't be judged or criticized before they're implemented? Maybe that's how the FIA thinks to approve this shit.

It may take 5 years for us to have a situation that exposes the flaws in this system, but the fact is this change has introduced flaws with little benefit. I believe the outcomes will be the same as the previous system 90% of the time, but the way those outcomes unfold will be very different. Instances of championships coming down to the last race can only be more rare with this system, and WDCs on average will be settled earlier. Do the math and there's no arguing that.

Not only that, as others have pointed out the driver's knowledge that you're not racing for the championship unless you're a threat to win will effect how they and the team attack mid-field battles, which could effect the outcome. As someone pointed out, drivers each season race to the rules they're given. I can only imagine the racing outside the podium will suffer for this.

And all this so that we can be certain the most wins gets the WDC, when in the past it's almost always been the case anyway.

So why, again, should we put up with this shit for a year before passing judgement?


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 8:28 am 
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Philthy82 wrote:
Th
It may take 5 years for us to have a situation that exposes the flaws in this system, but the fact is this change has introduced flaws with little benefit. I believe the outcomes will be the same as the previous system 90% of the time, but the way those outcomes unfold will be very different. Instances of championships coming down to the last race can only be more rare with this system, and WDCs on average will be settled earlier. Do the math and there's no arguing that.


Last season already exposed the flaws.
Massa had more wins but Hamilton more points.
Hamilton simply did better overall. Over the entire course of an entire season.
In the races you can't win, you must still do your best. And it also shows character to settle for 2nd if the guy in 1st isnt a direct competitor. Every driver wants to win so saying to yourself to save the car and settle for 2nd is something special as well....


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 8:35 am 
I think the system won't be too bad until retarded stewards decisions pop up and f... up everything like it was so many times last year.

Tbh, I'm not against the new system anymore, just the first emotions were bad.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 10:39 am 
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The FIA is getting more and more like a communist state every day. Drastic and sudden about turns, no transparency, power hungry members, what we say goes attitude and most importantly.....pretending to appeal to the masses yet only serving their vested interests.
But you would expect that from an organization that is fronted by a closet Nazi.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 3:46 pm 
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MaTT already made good points on this subject, I would like to propose another example to emphasize how this rule is above all stupid.
Suppose Barrichello wins the first 4 races, Button finishes right behind in second in all these 4. Then on the next 3, Button wins with Rubens second. Then happens that Brawn is not the best car anymore, and the follow wins to be splited by BMWs, Ferraris and another team else in such way that no driver achieve 3 victories anymore. Suppose now that through out the season Button finishes ahead of Rubens in every race.

So Button would finish 13 times ahead of the guy who have the same equipament, but his team mate would be the WDC just because when he finished ahead the situation was at the very front.

Of course, this is improbable to happen but this supposition is to show how the points for other positions are totally relevant cause they compute who finish ahead of who. Points when well distributed are almost the perfect mathmathical way to represents what the Championship was all about.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 4:17 pm 
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Are there actually any drivers who like this system?

Alonso's panned it, so has Jenson, Webber says it'll make races more exciting but as a driver he doesn't like it. Schumacher's also gone 'wtf?' at it...do any of them actually like it?


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 5:24 pm 
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What are the FIA people thinking who decided upon this system ?

"Ah we did well lads, everyone hates it, but we did well :thumbsup: "


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 5:25 pm 
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Quoting what I just wrote on another forum:

StefMeister wrote:
Lets not forget that Keke Rosberg won the 1982 Championship having scored only 1 win.

That was when the points syetem was 9/6/4/3/2/1 & only the best 11 finishes counted towards the championship.

There has always been an element of the F1 points system requiring consistency in order to win the championship. You can look at cases like Rosberg in 1982, Frentzen in 1999, Raikkonen in 2003 & Kubica last year. In each case a driver was able to take there championship challenge to the end of the year by consistency.

My biggest problem with the new rules are that there is now virtually no point to been consistent, you could only win 1 race yet finish on the podium in every race (Which would be a big acchievement) yet end up nowhere near been in championship contention.

One of the things that made last year so exciting was that up untill very late into the year we had 4 drivers that could have won the championship (Hamilton, Massa, Kubica & Raikkonen), under this years rules last years championship would have been down to 2 drivers by Mid-Season which I feel would have made the final half of the year less intresting.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 5:38 pm 
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Schumacher is also against new point system:
Schumacher shocked by late changes

Seven-time World Champion Michael Schumacher has explained how he is 'astonished' at the various rule changes to Formula 1 to come into affect for the next two years, and is shocked that the governing body made several moderations less than two weeks before the start of the new season.

Schumacher, who has attended pre-season tests in both Jerez and Barcelona over the last few weeks, first expressed his worries over the new KERS system which came into affect for 2009: "You have to say that KERS is a risk for all the teams using it, with the new restricted testing regulations. There are, as always, certain question marks before the first races but that's what makes the whole thing so attractive isn't it?"

The German struggled, however, to see the positive side to those rules imposed by the FIA this week: "I doubt the same goes for the new rules given out at such late notice prior to the start of the season," he continued. "It's something which is to me really, well, astonishing, as in previous years when the majority of teams wanted a rule change for a good reason, the FIA always said that it would not be possible in the short-term, or so late before the start of a season."

The new regulations, particularly those surrounding how the championship will be decided, have been met with mixed views by both those in and around Formula 1. "I cannot imagine those changes will help F1, especially regarding the new system to find the champion," Schumacher said on his website. "I cannot see how it makes sense to eventually have a World Champion who could have less points than the runner-up, although I also think it is a good move to try to strengthen the winner's position. Generally we should also make sure that F1 remains the top series of motorsport, also by displaying the competition with the highest levels of technology."

Michael went on to share his views following his spectating at tests: "I have been at tests to get an overview of the situation and can confidently say - let the season begin! I say this as a fan of both motorsports and of Ferrari; the last impressions were that we look pretty good and should be in the position to fight for the World Championship titles.

"The picture to me at the moment is that there are several teams able to be at the front; besides us there are Renault, Toyota, BMW and Williams as well - on the other hand, after Barcelona you clearly have to say that Ross' team was outstanding. They were one second in front, and if they can take that performance into the season they are strong too, even if the big teams will cut that advantage away with time, which is likely. McLaren, at the moment, looks pretty bad." Michael's comments did come, however, before Wednesday's running in Jerez this week which saw Heikki Kovalainen set the third fastest time of anybody there so far this winter.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 5:44 pm 
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RtN wrote:
Are there actually any drivers who like this system?

Alonso's panned it, so has Jenson, Webber says it'll make races more exciting but as a driver he doesn't like it. Schumacher's also gone 'wtf?' at it...do any of them actually like it?


Trulli apparently slammed it hard saying the FIA is trying to kill F1 and that he and his fellow competitors will be looking at different series to run in.

Trulli suddenly gained a shitload of respect from me....


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 5:47 pm 
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He is absolutely right though.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 7:35 pm 
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That's 3 out of 3 then (drivers who've spoken against it). Maybe the GPDA can back up the FOTA and bring the FIA down?


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 7:41 pm 
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Maybe if one driver is walking it wins wise the FIA might quietly back down on the idea if it'll prolong the championship battle mid-season?


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 8:19 pm 
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I guess. But really, to make this kind of title system before a season with so many significant changes already to improve racing/cost cutting, is a bit silly.

Lewis Hamilton's thoughts:
Quote:
Hamilton dislikes new F1 title rules


World champion Lewis Hamilton said he is not a fan of the new rules which will see the Formula One title awarded to the driver with the most race wins rather than points.

If the rules had been in operation in 2008, McLaren driver Hamilton would have finished runner-up to Ferrari's Felipe Massa.

"I don't like it really," the 24-year-old Briton told German tabloid Bild. "We want to be consistent, whether we come first or third.

"It should happen that a team and their drivers are rewarded for their performance over the whole year, not who won the most races."

4/4 now lol

Oh and just found this, Martin Brundle's view (he's for it)
http://www.crash.net/Formula+One/News/1 ... _a_go.html


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 8:34 pm 
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I like the new rule.

Because we might see some "accidents" where desperate seccond place drivers try to overtake the race leader and crash. All we need now are stewarts that don't penalize every driver's fart!
If there are any of them reading this, please take it easy! Go have yourself a coffee or whatever. Remeber, your decisions were often bigger scandals than the things that happened on track.

I like the new rule.
Could be a astonishing good thing, really! ;)


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 8:46 pm 
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Next up to complain: Webber!
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/73784

as is Heidfeld, Sutil and Rosberg apparently!


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 9:06 pm 
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I'd love to see Massa slam this insane rule harder than the pope slams gay marriage.

Also, I doubt it will actually work out the way the monkeys over at the FIA think it will work out.

In the end, if 2 drivers are tied in wins, the points will make a difference. So unless a driver really needs that win he could still settle for 2nd because those 8 points could still be the decider in the end.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 9:15 pm 
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micha wrote:
In the end, if 2 drivers are tied in wins, the points will make a difference. So unless a driver really needs that win he could still settle for 2nd because those 8 points could still be the decider in the end.

True and that's why I was saying consistency is still important, for the reason you've mentioned. :) BUT we have no clue how the competition is going to be, which is why I think it's a silly idea that this rule has been implemented before we get to even see what the show is like with so many technical and aero changes!


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 9:18 pm 
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The F1 fans do not like this system, F1 driver do not like the system, what on earth are they doing?


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 9:32 pm 
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Rudy88 wrote:
The F1 fans do not like this system, F1 driver do not like the system, what on earth are they doing?



The FIA is being the FIA......doing the opposite of everyone's wishes.

maybe if we all send congratulations cards and e-mails to the FIA telling how much we love this new idea they might think we really do like it and decide that they must again do the total opposite and install the old points system (or the proposed FOTA idea)


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