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| 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia https://www.tbk-light.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=40&t=7789 |
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| Author: | viXious [ Mon Sep 10, 2012 1:19 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia |
cambridge wrote: And for the racist thing, let me try to explain one thing for foreigners: you probably noticed those white flags whit a sort of a green wheel under the podium. Those are flags of a political party in italy wich is notorious for his racist behaviour and basically for their stupidity and sadly it's not even a small party. they are basically just idiots who hijack the visibility of the F1 gran prix, wich is held in the middle of the land they reclame as theirs, to show they're there. But basically they are not motorracing supporters. Thanks for the info, did some reading on it after you posted this. Here's some info for people that are interested: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Padania http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lega_Nord |
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| Author: | Talladega [ Mon Sep 10, 2012 7:20 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia |
Artur Craft wrote: Quote: Never, in 25 years of going to GPs, have I witnissed a reception like Lewis got this afternoon. Standing on the track at the podium ceremony, and there were whistles, boos, and plenty (and I mean PLENTY) of monkey noises and racist phrases being thrown out.  NextDimensional- wrote: This is why Ferrari is so special. Proud to be Ferrari fan  
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| Author: | cambridge [ Mon Sep 10, 2012 11:42 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia |
Scotty wrote: Lewis Hamilton gets booed every year at the Australian GP whenever he is on the podium. I haven't seen any racist monkey-type slurs or slanders from my POV, but my point is, it happens everywhere. for the lewis hamilton thing i'm 100% sure that if he next year comes to ferrari and wins in Monza, he will be treated like a hero. It's not the color of his skin that caused the booeing, is the color of his car. |
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| Author: | phil1993 [ Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:27 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia |
[youtubeidiot]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IAjuXFsW98A[/youtubeidiot] Looking this, I don't even think Sebastian realised Fernando was there. |
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| Author: | Gaara [ Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia |
Grosjean used that excuse... |
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| Author: | phil1993 [ Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia |
Gaara wrote: Grosjean used that excuse... I know, I'm not justifying it. I think that Sebastian was surprised by Fernando being there! |
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| Author: | amq55 [ Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:39 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia |
Vettel knows perfectly that Alonso's there, because that's not a normal racing line and because he glanced in his mirror at the 0:31 mark. |
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| Author: | Gaara [ Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:56 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia |
amq55 wrote: Vettel knows perfectly that Alonso's there, because that's not a normal racing line and because he glanced in his mirror at the 0:31 mark. You're right, he does glance in the mirror. |
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| Author: | Tobias [ Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia |
Alonso was moving very quickly to the left for a place that wasn't there really. Vettel had seen him coming on the inside but not the outisde. Given the corner is a long one to the right, and Alonso moves left with already almost no room to spare, I fail to see how Vettel deserved the penalty. |
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| Author: | kals [ Mon Sep 10, 2012 3:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia |
Well if the space wasn't there, how come he managed to fit his car alongside Vettel? |
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| Author: | phil1993 [ Mon Sep 10, 2012 3:03 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia |
The new rule is basically what Alonso said in Bahrain [youtubeidiot]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_sMZG0MLcc[/youtubeidiot] Vettel did not leave a space! |
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| Author: | Fish88 [ Mon Sep 10, 2012 3:06 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia |
And Vettel was aware of that rule  .[youtubeidiot]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcc0Nxq7itk[/youtubeidiot] |
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| Author: | Artur Craft [ Tue Sep 11, 2012 1:49 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia |
amq55 wrote: Vettel knows perfectly that Alonso's there, because that's not a normal racing line and because he glanced in his mirror at the 0:31 mark. you hit the nail right in the head here Since I first saw the incident live, I never doubted that Vettel deserved a penalty. The rules are different this year and that's how it is. The, once again, frustrating thing is the double standards, as DiResta would be quickly penalised, by me, too. Also, I don't agree with whoever claimed that 2011 was even worse. It wasn't. Alonso left slightly more space eventhough it would also be punished under current rules |
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| Author: | ellis [ Tue Sep 11, 2012 2:20 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia |
...not the normal racing line? Since when was that not the normal racing line? It has been since...well, forever. Quote: Also, I don't agree with whoever claimed that 2011 was even worse. It wasn't. Alonso left slightly more space eventhough it would also be punished under current rules In 2012 you could argue that Vettel went to block but the closing speed was too significant. In 2011 Vettel was alongside for a lot longer (a good half of the corner), and Alonso ran him off the road. That is FAR worse than trying to block a car. Ok different rules, fair enough, but di Restas move was far worse, and Jenons yellow flag ignorance should've carried a much harsher penalty than a drive through, and he got nothing. The gap Alonso was driving into was always going to close, whether Vettel was blocking or just taking the racing line, and THAT is the problem I have. He drove into a gap he KNEW was going to close, and the closing speed allowed it to look much dirtier than it actually was. He ran into a door then cried when he hurt himself. And the door was deemed to be at fault. Drivers will now have to predict the future and hope nobody is stupid enough to drive into a gaps which won't exist by the time they get there. |
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| Author: | kals [ Tue Sep 11, 2012 2:26 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia |
From all the videos and images I've seen of the 2011 incident ellis, Alonso did not push Vettel on to the grass rather Vettel chose to go there. Alonso pushed him as far to the edge of the track as possible but there was always still just enough room to run the cars side by side. |
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| Author: | aerogi [ Tue Sep 11, 2012 7:10 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia |
@  |
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| Author: | ellis [ Tue Sep 11, 2012 11:31 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia |
Scotty wrote: The one-car width rule needs to be (people will probably spray me for being a pussy, but here goes) much wider. 1 and a half car width at the minimum, even maybe 2. Agreed with both this and the closing speed point. Perhaps a good way of putting it is a "usable car width". You have to be able to fit a car in in driving conditions, not the exact width of a car. |
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| Author: | Tobias [ Tue Sep 11, 2012 11:34 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia |
I find it funny, but fascinating, how a few fractions of a second can provoke heated discussions lasting for days or even weeks. |
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| Author: | phil1993 [ Tue Sep 11, 2012 11:36 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia |
I agree with that. I also believe part of the problem nowadays (Christ, I sound like 90 not 19 there) is that a lot of these drivers now are getting used to very wide, new tracks - the likes of Shanghai, Sakhir, Sepang, Yeongam, Yas Marina, Istanbul Park - where there's a fair amount of space to move around. Suddenly, tracks such as Monza become the minority rather than the majority in that they're actually quite narrow. So every turn of the steering wheel when defending becomes exaggerated comparatively to the track width. I'd also argue that you need to clamp down on it in GP2 and GP3 as well to stop the trend from continuing. Bahrain was just a joke at times. Guys driving each other off the road and using the sand as a racing line! |
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| Author: | codename_47 [ Tue Sep 11, 2012 11:45 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 2012 Formula 1 Gran Premio Santander d'Italia |
Tobias wrote: I find it funny, but fascinating, how a few fractions of a second can provoke heated discussions lasting for days or even weeks. And some races (or tracks) are so boring they're forgotten forever..*cough* Hungary. But that's what provokes the most discussion here, it's not a pre-meditated evil plan of the drivers, its a split second reaction to extreme pressure that even they might regret 10 seconds after it has happened. We'll never know what was in the drivers heads at any particular moment and only the height of fanboyism of one driver vs another will post with certainty that they "knew he was thinking about running x driver off the road" "it was an accident, not deliberate" etc |
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