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2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix
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Author:  StefMeister [ Mon Aug 24, 2015 12:08 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix

Statement from Pirelli:
http://f1pressarea.pirelli.com/wp-conte ... oriale2015

Quote:
In November 2013, Pirelli requested that there should be rules to govern the maximum number of laps that can be driven on the same set of tyres, among other parameters to do with correct tyre usage. The proposal put forward a maximum distance equivalent to 50% of the grand prix distance for the prime tyre and 30% for the option. These conditions, if applied today at Spa, would have limited the maximum number of laps on the medium compound to 22.

Author:  webbsy [ Mon Aug 24, 2015 6:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix

I for one have just about had enough of all this kerb hoping. The kerbs ARE NOT part of the designated race track. The distance between white lines are. The kerbs are there solely as a safety measure/reference point. Its about time higher raised and more serrated kerbs are bought back. That would ensure that the track limits are respected.

As for a safety issue? I did not see one single mistake that made a driver go onto the kerbs because of ballsing up a corner. Mistakes were made cause drivers were abusing the kerbs and running over them (thinking Ricciardo and the GP2/3 crash)

Now imagine just how much of a challenge Eau Rouge would be if there was a big serrated kerb there and drivers had to drive between the white lines. It wouldn't be flat that's for sure. I can even deal with the acres of tarmac run off as a safety measure if there was a honking great big kerb on ever corner.

Author:  Justin Time [ Mon Aug 24, 2015 9:31 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix

webbsy wrote:
I for one have just about had enough of all this kerb hoping. The kerbs ARE NOT part of the designated race track. The distance between white lines are. The kerbs are there solely as a safety measure/reference point. Its about time higher raised and more serrated kerbs are bought back. That would ensure that the track limits are respected.

As for a safety issue? I did not see one single mistake that made a driver go onto the kerbs because of ballsing up a corner. Mistakes were made cause drivers were abusing the kerbs and running over them (thinking Ricciardo and the GP2/3 crash)

Now imagine just how much of a challenge Eau Rouge would be if there was a big serrated kerb there and drivers had to drive between the white lines. It wouldn't be flat that's for sure. I can even deal with the acres of tarmac run off as a safety measure if there was a honking great big kerb on ever corner.

I agree with this, minus the acceptance for tarmac run offs. If you put grass there, then drivers can't exceed the track limits anymore. They will get dirty tyres, kick up dust. Which would make racing also more spectacular again. Plus, more interesting kerbs. Now they are standardized. Even the brilliant Monza kerbs are gone, where the cars used to get airborne.

Author:  Omega [ Mon Aug 24, 2015 10:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix

FIA is concerned about safety, not spectacle.
I would like to see walls next to the track too, and worse breaks, and tyres that might or might not keep it together, and no tarmac run-off. It is killing the sport, but I will never believe for one moment that FIA will sacrifice a part of increased safety measures to improve the show again.

Author:  De Cesaris fan [ Mon Aug 24, 2015 11:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix

The drivers cut the corners so much and never respect the limits. It always makes me think that we're going to have loads of accidents when they race at Monaco, or anywhere that still has gravel and barriers close to the track, but that never happens. So either the drivers take more risks with big run offs, because they know they can get away with it, or they could make the corner if they really wanted to, but always take the easy way out. Either way, it arguably reduces driving standards and the general challenge massively.

Author:  mclaren2008 [ Mon Aug 24, 2015 12:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix

give the drivers a foot of extra track and they will use it - only way to stop it is to take it away

can't raise the kerbs because ramps
can't put walls closer because crashes and rebounding
can't use gravel traps because drivers might be out of the race if they enter

mistakes should be punished, skill should be rewarded - this is F1

Author:  Gaara [ Mon Aug 24, 2015 1:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix

All they had to do with gravel traps was allow drivers who spin off into it to be recovered. They're plenty punished by the time it takes to dig them out again.

Author:  codename_47 [ Mon Aug 24, 2015 1:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix

Which is how it works in american racing.

I have dim memories of da matta spinning off at mid ohio in i think 2002, getting stuck in the gravel and the caution coming out to retrieve him.
He went on to score points albeit a lap down.
It was the first time I realised the difference between the us and European mentality when it came to car recovery and I liked it better that way

Author:  gkmotorsport [ Mon Aug 24, 2015 2:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix

codename_47 wrote:
Which is how it works in american racing.

I have dim memories of da matta spinning off at mid ohio in i think 2002, getting stuck in the gravel and the caution coming out to retrieve him.
He went on to score points albeit a lap down.
It was the first time I realised the difference between the us and European mentality when it came to car recovery and I liked it better that way


This is probably the most sensible option - cars get stopped properly, they don't sit in the gravel and create a hazard, marshalls are protected, and the race doesn't lose a car.

Of course, it would also lead to more complaints about cautions ruining the racing ;)

Author:  Omega [ Mon Aug 24, 2015 3:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix

a race like yesterday in Pocono with 11 or more cautions wouldn't work in F1.

Author:  codename_47 [ Mon Aug 24, 2015 3:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix

gkmotorsport wrote:
codename_47 wrote:
Which is how it works in american racing.

I have dim memories of da matta spinning off at mid ohio in i think 2002, getting stuck in the gravel and the caution coming out to retrieve him.
He went on to score points albeit a lap down.
It was the first time I realised the difference between the us and European mentality when it came to car recovery and I liked it better that way


This is probably the most sensible option - cars get stopped properly, they don't sit in the gravel and create a hazard, marshalls are protected, and the race doesn't lose a car.

Of course, it would also lead to more complaints about cautions ruining the racing ;)


I've always hated that argument, particularly from the sportscar crowd, who think they have a monopoly on "purism"

I'd much rather a few sc periods to clean up incidents properly than either a permanent yellow at a section of track or even worse a rush job done under waved yellows which could lead to debris or oil not being cleared up sufficiently and further problems later on.

But no, people like to shout about how their series is not artificial compared to others because their marshals and drivers are put In harms way more to keep their races green. REAL RACING! :roll:

Caution periods are part of racing, life itself is a bit of a lottery, motorsport fans just need to get over it and realise they're going to happen eventually and they don't ruin races.
And only really nascar uses them for show.

Author:  gkmotorsport [ Mon Aug 24, 2015 4:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix

codename_47 wrote:
I've always hated that argument, particularly from the sportscar crowd, who think they have a monopoly on "purism"

I'd much rather a few sc periods to clean up incidents properly than either a permanent yellow at a section of track or even worse a rush job done under waved yellows which could lead to debris or oil not being cleared up sufficiently and further problems later on.

But no, people like to shout about how their series is not artificial compared to others because their marshals and drivers are put In harms way more to keep their races green. REAL RACING! :roll:

Caution periods are part of racing, life itself is a bit of a lottery, motorsport fans just need to get over it and realise they're going to happen eventually and they don't ruin races.
And only really nascar uses them for show.


Tbh I think a lot of people equate 'caution period' with 'NASCAR-style invisibris', as in an attempt to artificially spice up the show. I don't think it has ever really been used that way in F1, but maybe steps could be taken to speed up the process so that we don't end up with several laps on a clear track.

Author:  kals [ Mon Aug 24, 2015 5:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix

It appears that Pastor was the master of his own demise from the Belgian GP - http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/120475

Author:  LucasWheldon [ Mon Aug 24, 2015 7:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix

he ran out of money perhaps?

Author:  gd49 [ Mon Aug 24, 2015 7:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: RE: Re: 2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix

kals wrote:
It appears that Pastor was the master of his own demise from the Belgian GP - http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/120475

Think the coverage just caught him going over the kerbs at Eau Rouge, one of the things FOM chose not to replay, along with Verstappens overtake round the outside of Blanchimont. Not sure I'd call it a massive off, several drivers did the same thing in free practice with no problems. Think maybe the Lotus team have had enough of Pastor this season

Author:  kals [ Mon Aug 24, 2015 7:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: RE: Re: 2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix

gd49 wrote:
kals wrote:
It appears that Pastor was the master of his own demise from the Belgian GP - http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/120475

Think the coverage just caught him going over the kerbs at Eau Rouge, one of the things FOM chose not to replay, along with Verstappens overtake round the outside of Blanchimont. Not sure I'd call it a massive off, several drivers did the same thing in free practice with no problems. Think maybe the Lotus team have had enough of Pastor this season


Yeah I get the impression from Permane's interview that he's a little frustrated. Pastor's money has been useful to Lotus these past couple of year's, but they've barely any return to show from it other than a lot of damage. I wonder if the damage is equal to if not more than the money that Pastor brings to Lotus?

Author:  acopip [ Tue Aug 25, 2015 7:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix

codename_47 wrote:
acopip wrote:
Did Alonso pass 5, 6 cars there?


Bit late, but I think he passed at least 106 cars at the start :p

hehe :lol:
Great start really, just watched it again :thumbsup:

Author:  Bleu [ Tue Aug 25, 2015 8:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix

Omega wrote:
What did Vettel do? Retire? Pit for a new tyre?


Coming to the pits, he crossed the timing line about 12 seconds before Hamilton came to chequered flag. So even if they had replaced the tyre there was not much sense to drive one more lap.

Author:  kals [ Tue Aug 25, 2015 4:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix

Gary Anderson wrote:
While I'm on about track limits, I listened to Sebastian Vettel's rant after the race about Pirelli tyres, and, yes, he has something to say, and I would be the first to back him up if I had enough information around me to make a well-enough-informed decision on what happened to his tyre, or Nico Rosberg's failure on Friday.

But I don't have the facts, and neither did Sebastian when he verbally abused a very necessary supplier to Formula 1.

One thing he did say that I believe was rubbish was that neither he nor Rosberg went off the track prior to their tyre failures.

I suggest he has a look at the replays, and if he still sticks by what he said after the race I will personally get him an appointment at an optician.

When we go to Monza, we could very easily have the same problem. Personally, I doubt if any driver will ever stay between the white lines on the exit of the Ascari chicane.

Will that be deemed legal or illegal?

And if someone picks up a cut tyre while running out there in the marbles because it is faster, will they blame Pirelli too? Of course they will. Drivers are basically spoiled little kids and on the first page of the excuse book is 'find someone else to blame', never take the rap yourself.


Full article here - http://plus.autosport.com/premium/featu ... 1423160073

Author:  Dan Belcher [ Tue Aug 25, 2015 5:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2015 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand Prix

That is a beautiful quote.

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